The last post asked the question why pay for sex?
I, personally, think one of the primary reasons for phone sex is to avoid all the messy entanglements of real life dating! When you know you want to get off and know how you want to do it (for example with fetish sex with a Femdom Mistress) then why would you want the hassle of the dating dance? That’s the way I see it, but I’m pretty blunt and practical. You might see it differently and I’d like to hear from you!
IM Chat about real life options of finding a Femdom
Today, we continue with the IM Chat with the man who wants to experience Femdom in person. We’ve talked about possible solutions.
I answered his questions about the differences between a Pro Domme and an escort. And, now we’re talking about finding a partner in the real life fetish scene.
You might find a really skilled Domme here who does the play for love of the scene but since She isn’t full-time in the fetish sex scene with experiences with large numbers of partners, I think of her as an amateur. And, let’s face it, even in a fetish sex relationship it’s still a relationship with emotional landmines as you can see from our IM chat.
IM chat continues with his comments about real life dating
Ms Olivia: I want you to write Me, here, some of the emotional *stuff* that you’ve experienced with dating. After this call, I’ll relate that to kink dating.
Man: ok. Some of the big emotional stuff I’ve experienced includes: crying during sex b/c past lover cheated on them; lots of enthusiasm at first then too “afraid” to go further; “too old” for that sort of play; “fear” that this means you want someone who isn’t her; judgments that this is okay, but “this” isn’t.
Ms Olivia: *nods* YES !!!!! So, even if you get an amateur who is *into* kink, you’re getting into a potentially emotional minefield of sex, emotions and relationships. If you get a legit professional you’re not going to have to deal with that. If any woman who is a professional sex worker starts a sob story about how tough her life is then she is either *playing* you (not sex, not fun) or she’s turning to sex work because she desperate. Not as a career choice. For example………This started as a *lark* for Me but has become a career choice. BUT, I don’t meet in person.
Ms Olivia: I don’t have anything morally against paid professional in person sex but I’m clear that’s not for Me. Plus, it is illegal in most areas. I don’t even do Pro Domme stuff in person. I like the aural part of phone sex. It’s also safer for a variety of reasons. Now, I do play in person with My boy friend and our play party friends. But, that is for free and for fun. The PROBLEMS start when you being money and friendship into contact. So, for someone who wants a free session with Me ….. problems. LOL
Man: lol makes perfect sense
Mistress articulates her boundaries
Ms Olivia: Now, professionally I keep My boundaries. I’m very clear about what I do and what My limits are. I’m okay if someone pushes the limits…..horny men do that and don’t even realize it. And, I’ll just keep stating limits…….if he continues to push and I continue to state My limits, I will eventually get to a point where I switch to a Meta conversation and say: “I’m telling you My limits, stop pushing them. This is not negotiable.” At that point, he’ll usually wake up.
Ms Olivia: If he continues to push then I back off and eventually discontinue the conversation.
Man: as well you should
Ms Olivia: *nods* Yes, I am VERY OPEN but when I say no……unless we’re in a scene that requires manipulation that’s been asked for……I mean NO. LOL So, I state limits and stick to them. NOW……….this is MUCH harder in a *relationship* do you see how things get *sticky* …… emotionally sticky and conversationally sticky.
Man: absolutely….it’s also what makes the sexual part of the relationship so..challenging
Ms Olivia: *nods* YES! What I’ve done is I’ve been able to do the sex and the limits with My guy…..but I think we’re both independent enough that we don’t play those *relationship games*. I like sex games……..the mind games, the push pulll, the fakey (or not) arguments and the passive agressive behavior isn’t My thing…..personally OR professionally. I can (and do) walk away from clients who want that during free time.
Man: 100% agree
Ms Olivia: When he’s paying for My time, I’ll do it as a scene…..but chats like this I have to enjoy! LOL It’s My free time. YOU…… I totally enjoy
Man: Thank you – that is mutual, obviously
Experienced Mistress is….well….experienced!
Ms Olivia: You’ve got the pros and the cons for all three (Pro Domme, escort and amateur fetish enthusiast) One thing that I also want to point out that is a difference between ANY sex worker and a *civilian amateur* is that I’ve encountered thousands of men. I think men are even more honest on the phone…….so I have a wealth of experience and knowledge……not just about sex but about men in particular. Like ANY experienced professional you also have access to that knowledge.
Man: I would agree wholeheartedly there. I’ve spent time with online sex coaches who have not been nearly as insightful, honest, informative, or educational as you to be frank
Ms Olivia: OMG ! LOL You HAVE to tell Me more about that!
How’s that for a tease for tomorrow’s blog? LOL So, look for it. Now, to your questions. Have you dated inside of the fetish world? How do YOU handle all the relationship stuff that goes along with dating (fetish or vanilla)? What comments, suggestion or advice do you have for him … or that you’d care to share with other readers of My blog?
“I think men are even more honest on the phone.”
This rings true to me, but i don’t think that the “phone” serves as some kind of truth serum. Rather, it’s the force of personality of the woman on the other end of the line (not to mention the fact that she’s a professional) that makes it so easy to open up over the phone.
Terrific post as always, Ms. Olivia!
Thank you G ! And it was FANTASTIC to get to ….. ahem …. ‘know’ you the other day! ~laughs~ Phone sex really IS an amazing connection isn’t it?
It’s certainly something that i really enjoy and i love it more and more each time i do it!
*winks* @ gMan. Have YOU been behaving yourself? Hmmmmmmm? LOL
i think, Ms. Olivia, that what option is best ultimately comes down to the “need” which is a fluid thing.
for me, the ideal situation (at least i believe) would be a 24/7 one, where the kink play was a component, but the D/s component is subtly woven throughout. however, given i consider myself damaged emotional goods, i’m not going to go looking for THAT.
from my perspective, a phone Domme, particularly once a level of mutual comfort & trust is established, can easily & securely address most of my “needs.” there is so much comfort in well established boundary conditions, and over the phone, if limits aren’t being honored on either side, the “Off” button is the ultimate safeword.
so “needs” (or more accurately…itches) simply cannot be met by a phone Domme, regardless of the skill and creativity of both parties. for instance, if i were to feel the need to be immobilized and tormented to absolute distraction…to truly feel helpless as a flogger is teasingly dragged across my naughty bits (g)…and money is not a constraint, i’m researching local ProDommes.
@ coffeeboy……your points are ALL well taken. I’m not advocating any one particular option. Rather informed decision making about various choices.
I *do* think that in the huge world we live in there are LOTS of people available for all kinds of things. I love what you said about hanging up as the ultimate safeword! I agree! For example, if I get an inquiry from someone who wants Me to take total control of all aspects of their life and/or make decisions (take actions) for them that are ultimately theirs to be accountable for then that’s a red flag for Me.
I agree also that need is a fluid thing. I’m not in Domme mode all the time. Yes, I’m in that Femdom mode most of the time when logged in for phone sex, but even there, I’m not ‘on’ in that way all the time. With certain callers it’s fluid and I’m flexible. Oh wait…..I just re-read that sentence and saying phone sex is fluid just cracked Me up so I can’t even write now !
*giggle* Oh MY !
fluid phone sex = the cure for turgid thinking!
You either ARE a Tom Lehrer fan…..or perhaps you ARE him!
Do tell! LOL
would that i could be that creative, Ms. Olivia. Thank You! of course now i’ve got the chorus to “The Vatican Rag” stuck in my head, which makes You a cruel Mistress indeed!
Here are your instructions:
First you get down on your knees……..
Fiddle with your ……. ahem …. rosaries ……
Bow your head with great respect …….
*sigh* Now that song is stuck in My head too …… that and My favorite spring time love song: Poisoning Pigeons in the Parkl ~laughs~
MsOlivia, I have very much enjoyed reading this series of posts.
One thing I like to say is that Dommes are real people. Obvious in one way, but perhaps not so in others, at least not so to everyone. I’ve mentioned the stereotype of the leather clad Domme, tough as nails, ready to dish out punishment. Not saying she doesn’t exist, but most Dommes have many more facets than that. They cry when sad. They need companions, friends, lovers. They deal with the world as we all do. To be in a real relationship with someone who identifies herself as a Domme is to be in a relationship with a woman first. A Dominant woman, but a woman with all the needs and desires that women have. (Not that they all have the exact same set, but I think You know what I mean.)
With the pro Domme, there is that professional relationship, perhaps not one might think of first when that term is mentioned, but it definitely qualifies. There are boundaries present with the paying for the service. Not unlike Your own boundaries You’ve mentioned (and rightly so). There can certainly be a connection there, but the service/client relationship holds supreme (or at least it should barring some of the exceptions You mentioned). The client pays for what he wants, gets it, and then goes home.
With what you term amateur, it’s not all about you. (You in the general sense, not in the MsOlivia sense. lol) That is, with the pro, one is the customer and can vote with their wallet if the pro doesn’t measure up to expectations. With the amateur one is in a relationship and with all relationships, both sides have needs. Both sides have to work at being together. That working together would be far more than just the BSDM part, though that would be part. I think this kind of thing is wonderful if the couple can make it work, and many can, but they have to keep in mind it’s not all play.
WELL SAID magnus !! Exactly so! The *stereotype* of the hot leather clad Domme is just that (even in person) … a fantasy. When it’s a paid service you pay for the delivery of your fantasy …. even if your fantasy is to please Her. It IS, by definition, more compartmentalized than real life and in many ways that’s exactly what is desired and needed!
As you said, in any real life relationship there’s SO much more! Last year, My guy had to sit frustrated thousands of miles away while I dealt with some family stuff. He had to listen to Me cry and that was frustrating for him and not at all sexy for either of us. BUT, that is some of the stuff that goes on in relationships. Personally, I like the mixture (both of us as multi faceted people).
Now, I’m thinking of how relationships are fluid and I’ve flashed on a comment/reply to coffeeboy and I’m starting to laugh about the *fluid* nature of phone sex ….. excuse Me please while I go giggle!
“Crying during sex.”
Man did that ever hit a nerve.
I usually just apologize and tell her that “work’s been really stressful lately” and promise to do a lot better next time.
I live in Hooterville (actually an ass backward suburb of Hooterville) so I think any local fetish scene is best left unexplored due to the numerous laws of nature that are probably being violated whenever the locals get their freak on. Not to mention parking at the Elk’s Club on Saturday night is just a bitch.
That said, the issue I see with dating someone in the fetish scene would be “What’s the relationship like when you’re not fetishing. Sex is wonderful but what do you do with the other 23 hours each day. Well 23 hours, 55 minutes and 32 seconds. (Again I’d like to point out that I have a very high pressure job and these are still tough economic times).
I think the phone sex, pro dome solutions makes sense for a lot of men. The reality of most relationships is that you’re going to need more than just a common kink interest to make it work long term.
It might be more realistic to find someone with a higher sex drive and an openness to experiment than to focus on finding someone with your exact fetish or kink. That seems to be needle and haystack stuff but I could be wrong and I wish everyone the best in finding what makes them happy.
Remember in real life the fantasy may never be as perfect as when you pay for it, but ground chuck to a starving man is Wagyu Filet Mignon.
*snicker* *giggle* and tee hee !
You DO make Me laugh! Can’t even imagine what might happen when the locals of Hooterville Junction get their freak on! But, I have seen that there’s a problem with parking at the Elk’s Club on a Saturday night. That’s the time you say, Fuck it Knight Rider, I’ve GOT the potato salad, let me IN. Of course, you might get arrested for that.
You mentioned TIME and the fetish stuff. OMG, I have to tell you about something that happened this last weekend! I was with My guy and we were doing this hot fantasy/real life thingy ….. both of us totally into it…..fully engaged and on that kink emotional roller coaster! We did it for only 30 minutes! LOL We both were like, woah! Go figure! We thought it was way longer! After getting settled down we were both, hmmmmmm…..want to go to the ballgame now? LOL Yeah the kink is great, but it’s the other time together that will make or break the actual relationship!
Phone sex is verbal filet mignon! LOL
Am I a big fan of the relationship-oriented phone sex option, and it has been a wonderful experience for me, but there are limits.
I’ve been reading a great BDSM lifestyle book called “Uniquely Rika.” (Have you read it?) She talks a lot about the service side of the D/s relationship. I feel that service oriented submission would be very rewarding for me, but that is something that’s a lot harder to do in a phone-sex context. Part of the reason is that paid phone sex is 90% about the client’s needs, but one of my deepest desires is to truly be of service to a lady/mistress, based on her actual needs, kinky or not.
Another limitation is simply physical intimacy. The other night I was in bed by myself and had this phantom feeling of someone hugging me from behind. It has been so long since I’ve felt the intimate touch of a lover. Unfortunately you can’t get that from phone sex, no matter how special the person on the other side of the line is.
We live in a wonderful world full of options. I think life is about learning and exploring all of those wonderful options.
@ slavemind…..I looked up Uniquely Rika …. that looks amazing. I think the *service* part of a submissive relationship calls to many people. I haven’t read the book but what I liked about the description was that it seems like actual *service* not merely a set of protocols. She appears to make a distinction between acts of service and the motivations behind the actions and I like that a LOT.
Ahhhhhh…….I understand about physical intimacy. You’re right, that’s not going to happen with phone sex and human beings do need physical touch (sexual or not). Studies have been done on the healing powers of touch. Touch combined with intimacy is ….. whew….that’s a space beyond words.
And YET …. have you ever been in the same bed with someone and the gulf between the two of you was so WIDE that the negative vibrations are exhausting? I can’t remember where I saw the quote that said this quote well …. it’s a common theme …. something like, it’s better to be lonely alone then it is to be lonely WITH someone. Ann Landers said it great, “It is far better to be alone, then wish you were!” I agree.
Part of this is the ‘essential loneliness’ of simply being human. The separation from …… and yearning to be connected back….and that is, as you know, the profoundly spiritual journey.
BTW, I salute you for looking at all of this as OPTIONS and learning, growing and exploring from all of the experiences! Me too, as you know ! 🙂